| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Jenny
Joined: 12 Jun 2007
Posts: 224
Location: Sweden
|
 Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 12:01 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
| Quote: | Jenny said:
Quote:
There are several authors whose books I used to love but their latest efforts have been a huge disappointment to me. I keep buying and reading their books because I keep hoping they will write like they used to do. Unfortunately they don't and I get disappointed all over again.
Eliza said:
Quote:
To continue reading an author you no longer enjoy. . . well, it reminds me of the definition of Insanity by Albert Einstein: "doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." |
Insane it might be, but what love isn't insane in a way? Even a love of certain author's books or writing style. Sometimes it is hard to let go when your keeper bookshelf tells you what your beloved authors are capable of. That keeper shelf keeps the hope alive, that they will write like they used to do.
I will say that it is easier for me to abandon an author who has changed genres than the one who has changed writing style.
| Quote: |
Jenny said:
Quote:
It is nice to vent sometimes and maybe some readers hope an author/publisher will take notice of their objections and do something about the issues that have been brought forth.
Eliza said:
Quote:
And you as a reader can go with what they're doing or not. Read them or just stop. That's YOUR choice. Expecting an author to write according to your personal expectations or by a committee vote sounds just loony to me. |
I never said anything about "expecting an author to write according to your personal expectations or by a committee vote".
The word I used was hope.
I hope an author might listen to me if I tell her she needs to use more show and less tell. I hope an author might listen to me if I say she needs to use more dialogue. I hope an author might listen to me if I say there are too many inner thoughts.
But I as a reader, a consumer of an author's books for which I pay, I do expect the book to be grammatically correct and decently if not well researched. I do expect an author to give me a new story not a recycled one.
Last edited by Jenny on Thu Feb 23, 2012 2:10 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Linda in sw va
Joined: 27 Mar 2007
Posts: 4707
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 12:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Jenny wrote: | [The word I used was hope.
I hope an author might listen to me if I tell her she needs to use more show and less tell. I hope an author might listen to me if I say she needs to use more dialog. I hope an author might listen to me if I say there are too many inner thoughts.
But I as a reader, a consumer of an author's books for which I pay I do expect the book to be grammatically correct and decently if not well researched. I do expect an author to give me a new story not a recycled one. |
Jenny, I have wondered before if readers post criticism here and elsewhere with the hope of influencing an author, it kinds of seems like yes? Not that there's anything wrong with hoping your voice will be heard but you are possibly hoping to influence as well as vent?
I sometimes get a sense of an agenda when I see complaints about certain themes, I feel like there's something else going on, the hope to discourage authors from using this theme the readers dislikes so much. Be it Secret Baby, Big Mis, Small Town etc.
I'm going to be honest and say that I hope there is very little influence from readers for an author, unless it's along the lines of hoping to see a character get their own book etc. Because for every complaint about something an author may hear there's likely a reader that was quite happy with how it was written. Look how many books/authors/characters end up on both the favorites and least favorites lists in the author polls. People are more likely to speak out when they are dissatisfied with something, the loudest isn't always the majority though obviously. I know there are times when I've read a reader say that something should have been done differently and I think..oh that would have ruined everything, it was fine as is. 
Linda
_________________
"The Bookshop has a thousand books, all colors, hues and tinges, and every cover is a door that turns on magic hinges." ~ Nancy Byrd Turner |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ridley
Joined: 22 Feb 2012
Posts: 1
Location: United States
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 1:30 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| xina wrote: | | dick wrote: |
PS: I visit DA all the time and I still don't get the reference to Ridley! |
To put it kindly (since we are attempting to avoid the negative), she enjoys jumping into the fray. A lot. (or alot) |
I don't know whether to be flattered or ashamed that my name was invoked in a community I don't belong to and people I don't know are talking about me.
I'm going to choose the former, I think. I'm too awesome for shame. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
bookmark
Joined: 06 Nov 2007
Posts: 296
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 2:01 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I haven't read most of the replies, but I have to say I do get annoyed whenever criticism/venting/however one sees it is criticized. Only in the sense that somehow giving one's negative opinions are not welcomed/are annoying. There's a big difference between dislikes/frustrations/hate against parts of fiction and all it encompasses and real people. Just because it seems like people are focusing more on the negative aspects doesn't in any way reflects all the positives they have that are not expressed. Seemingly negative opinions on any board are reflective of real life trials and tribulations. Everything we suffer in real life from the very tiny to major are likely to be expressed and felt more than the good. I notice for me, I tend to bask and enjoy the positives in silence and am more vocal or demonstrative in the negative. That doesn't in any way mean I'm less appreciative of the good things in life. In fact I hold them dear. I can only liken it to the feeling negative energy needs to be dispersed from my body while positive ones encompass me. Hence, my complaints. LOL. And honestly, good or bad, when I love something it's more of a feeling and verboseness is not in me. I can never participate very well in a "gush" post for some reason because there's really nothing for me to discuss beyond giving the reasons why I love. I just don't see negative opinions or complaints as bad, it actually gives me more of an understanding/insight into different points of views and where people are coming from provided of course that those complaints are reasonable to me. It also does bother me (the way it did when I used to be at another site a lot, which I no longer am at), people complaining what they don't like and not doing anything about it. I remember people at the other site complaining about lack of discussion worthy posts and too much general chit-chat. Those same people never attempt to put the type of posts they long for, and the discussion worthy posts didn't get as much replies or discussion. If people don't like negative posts or whatever is out, put up positive ones or whatever they would like to see.
Having said all that, I completely understand the OP and people who feel the same way. I really do. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Jenny
Joined: 12 Jun 2007
Posts: 224
Location: Sweden
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 2:06 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Linda in sw va wrote: |
Jenny, I have wondered before if readers post criticism here and elsewhere with the hope of influencing an author, it kinds of seems like yes? Not that there's anything wrong with hoping your voice will be heard but you are possibly hoping to influence as well as vent? |
Well, yes, I guess I am. Or at least I can only wish for that kind of power but I don't expect it.
I usually give up on an author if/when she changes genres or writing style. I am aware that I don't have any hope of influencing in any way an author who has left the romance genre. But those who have changed their writing style, I have maybe a misguided hope of being able to influence little. Well, at least when it come to books that have became boring and repetitive, in which the use of tell was so overwhelming that it made me think I was reading a newspaper report and not a romance novel.
| Quote: |
I sometimes get a sense of an agenda when I see complaints about certain themes, I feel like there's something else going on, the hope to discourage authors from using this theme the readers dislikes so much. Be it Secret Baby, Big Mis, Small Town etc.
|
I agree some readers might have an agenda.
Speaking for myself...
When it comes to plot and themes I would never presume to influence an author because it is their story, their creation. They want to tell what they want to tell even if I don't like it. I can only say "I wish you would write a book with this theme..." or "I wish you didn't have the hero cheat..." but I cannot and don't demand for that to happen or not happen in the next book.
| Quote: |
I'm going to be honest and say that I hope there is very little influence from readers for an author, unless it's along the lines of hoping to see a character get their own book etc. Because for every complaint about something an author may hear there's likely a reader that was quite happy with how it was written. Look how many books/authors/characters end up on both the favorites and least favorites lists in the author polls. People are more likely to speak out when they are dissatisfied with something, the loudest isn't always the majority though obviously. I know there are times when I've read a reader say that something should have been done differently and I think..oh that would have ruined everything, it was fine as is.
Linda |
Yes, I hope a reader can influence an author's writing at least a little bit, mostly about the things I mentioned in my previous post, more dialogue, more show less tell, less repetition... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Yulie
Joined: 22 Mar 2007
Posts: 1045
Location: Elsewhere
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 3:19 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Seeing as how this thread has been ongoing: every few months there's a thread here about how the AAR forums are not active enough/sufficiently/positive/offer much variety in terms of topics. None of these seem to have any long term effect. I'm all for venting, but wouldn't it be more productive to try and change the tone by starting new threads or commenting about the topics people would like to see more of?
I fail to see what Ridley has to do with the topic at hand. Unless the suggestion is that having an opinionated poster like her would be conducive to livelier discussions.
You know what this forum needs? vBulletin. But I've suggested it more than once, and it never helps.
| Linda in sw va wrote: | | I sometimes get a sense of an agenda when I see complaints about certain themes, I feel like there's something else going on, the hope to discourage authors from using this theme the readers dislikes so much. Be it Secret Baby, Big Mis, Small Town etc. |
Why shouldn't we complain if we don't like a theme or a trope? Why is it wrong to say that there are some things we're not interested in buying and reading? If you're complaining about authors writing AA characters or multicultural romances, yes, I'd say that's an issue. But why is it a bad thing for a reader to express her dislike for secret baby books or the big mis or virgins in contemps? Even if it is part of an "agenda" to dissuade authors from writing such books - so what? How is that different from providing feedback about other products, which consumers often do?
There's a readership for different types of books and I seriously doubt that complaining on AAR will dissuade an author from writing something that sells. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ladynaava
Joined: 11 Apr 2007
Posts: 938
Location: California
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 4:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
what's wrong with an agenda? Heh. I 'complain' with an agenda all the time. =-) I don't see that really as any different as 'gushing' with an agenda in the effort to encourage an author to write more of what they love. Customers are consumers and wanting more of what we enjoy and less about we don't enjoy is normal.
A prime example is Laurell Hamilton.
I complain with an agenda, because I really detest some of the themes she's brought into her work of late and do hope she'll change. I am not FORCING her to change, which would be wrong, but I think its entirely okay, to complain about a direction a favorite author has chosen. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Linda in sw va
Joined: 27 Mar 2007
Posts: 4707
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 4:53 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ladynaava wrote: | what's wrong with an agenda? Heh. I 'complain' with an agenda all the time. =-) I don't see that really as any different as 'gushing' with an agenda in the effort to encourage an author to write more of what they love. Customers are consumers and wanting more of what we enjoy and less about we don't enjoy is normal.
A prime example is Laurell Hamilton.
I complain with an agenda, because I really detest some of the themes she's brought into her work of late and do hope she'll change. I am not FORCING her to change, which would be wrong, but I think its entirely okay, to complain about a direction a favorite author has chosen. |
Oh my gosh, anyone still reading and complaining about LKH deserves what they get!  One of the best choices I ever made was to purge this author and her books, oh the relief!!
I never said it was 'wrong' to complain with an agenda, just making an observation and adding the fact that I hope author's don't pay it too much attention and I include myself in there too. In fact, it's been stated in this thread that many will only get vocal if they are unhappy and don't feel the urge to gush. So, for every unhappy vocal reader there is likely to be many perfectly happy silent ones, yes even LKH ones. Why alienate them by changing it up? I say write where the inspiration takes you and let the chips fall where they may, some will love it and others will not but as soon as you start trying to please one group you are likely to be disappointing another.
I've made no secret that I loathe and despise secret baby books and if anyone wants to know the book that tipped me over on this one I'm sure I could be encouraged to get going on it. *G* But that said, I don't have an agenda that I want authors to stop writing them, I know there are other readers out there that enjoy them, go figure, and who am I to try and spoil their fun? 
When I gush about a book or an author my only agenda is that I'm so darn happy I have to shout it out! To an author it is to say THANK YOU! Books that are that good are like little treasures, they're gifts and I am so grateful for the enjoyment and the creation of their beloved characters.
Linda
_________________
"The Bookshop has a thousand books, all colors, hues and tinges, and every cover is a door that turns on magic hinges." ~ Nancy Byrd Turner |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
xina
Joined: 22 Mar 2007
Posts: 6627
Location: minneapolis
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 5:05 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I don't think there is anything wrong with complaining to an author, but I don't know how much good it will do. Doesn't an author write what is inside, and no matter what readers say, they problably aren't going to change. Years ago I was on a message board with Stella Cameron (no, not this board). It was long ago, before I developed a tolerance for the meanish hero. I complained to her telling her how much I hated her hero. She responded by saying...I'm so sorry you were disappointed. That wasn't my intent. And I thought...of course it wasn't. I haven't done that since. Personally, if I don't like an author's direction, I just don't read his/her work. Easy.
_________________
"As you wish"
~The Princess Bride |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Eliza
Joined: 21 Aug 2011
Posts: 713
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 5:39 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Linda in sw va wrote: | | I'm going to be honest and say that I hope there is very little influence from readers for an author, unless it's along the lines of hoping to see a character get their own book etc. Because for every complaint about something an author may hear there's likely a reader that was quite happy with how it was written. Look how many books/authors/characters end up on both the favorites and least favorites lists in the author polls. People are more likely to speak out when they are dissatisfied with something, the loudest isn't always the majority though obviously. I know there are times when I've read a reader say that something should have been done differently and I think..oh that would have ruined everything, it was fine as is. Linda |
This. 
Yulie said:
| Quote: | | There's a readership for different types of books and I seriously doubt that complaining on AAR will dissuade an author from writing something that sells. |
This too.
ladynaava said:
| Quote: | | Customers are consumers and wanting more of what we enjoy and less about we don't enjoy is normal. |
While this is indeed true, and we do "vote" in a sense with our wallets, I personally cringe at the word "consumers" (even though it's true), at valuing some things in our culture by monetary standards, especially anything related to art, of which romance is a form just IMHO, depending on the author, like any other artist (or hack?). Money is a fact of life, I know; many writers need to make money, and many readers have strict budgets these days, so of course it comes up. It's just my own choice when I read a book, including romances, to shut out the commercial, materialistic world with which I feel bombarded from many directions at times.
Now please note that I am just expressing my own personal opinion and am not suggesting it, pushing it, or trying to sell it to a single other soul. Nor am I criticizing this poster for her word choice. It's just a word that comes up a lot everywhere and happens to fit in with the direction this thread is now taking. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Linda in sw va
Joined: 27 Mar 2007
Posts: 4707
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 5:40 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| xina wrote: | | I Years ago I was on a message board with Stella Cameron (no, not this board). It was long ago, before I developed a tolerance for the meanish hero. I complained to her telling her how much I hated her hero. She responded by saying...I'm so sorry you were disappointed. That wasn't my intent. And I thought...of course it wasn't. I haven't done that since. Personally, if I don't like an author's direction, I just don't read his/her work. Easy. |
Xina, I am heartened to hear author responses like this! I did hear something like this from an author years ago and did a little cheer, good for them!
I also enjoyed seeing Diana Gabaldon answer her critical letters in The Outlandish Companion, there is another author that is not going to be esily swayed by one person or another's opnion and believes in what she's writing. Take it or leave it. I really feel that it is this factor that makes her books stand out from the crowd and such a success.
Linda
_________________
"The Bookshop has a thousand books, all colors, hues and tinges, and every cover is a door that turns on magic hinges." ~ Nancy Byrd Turner |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Eliza
Joined: 21 Aug 2011
Posts: 713
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 5:49 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Linda in sw va wrote: | | xina wrote: | | I Years ago I was on a message board with Stella Cameron (no, not this board). It was long ago, before I developed a tolerance for the meanish hero. I complained to her telling her how much I hated her hero. She responded by saying...I'm so sorry you were disappointed. That wasn't my intent. And I thought...of course it wasn't. I haven't done that since. Personally, if I don't like an author's direction, I just don't read his/her work. Easy. |
Xina, I am heartened to hear author responses like this! I did hear something like this from an author years ago and did a little cheer, good for them!
I also enjoyed seeing Diana Gabaldon answer her critical letters in The Outlandish Companion, there is another author that is not going to be esily swayed by one person or another's opnion and believes in what she's writing. Take it or leave it. I really feel that it is this factor that makes her books stand out from the crowd and such a success.
Linda |
Yet another...This too! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Linda in sw va
Joined: 27 Mar 2007
Posts: 4707
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 5:56 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Yulie wrote: | | But why is it a bad thing for a reader to express her dislike for secret baby books or the big mis or virgins in contemps? Even if it is part of an "agenda" to dissuade authors from writing such books - so what? How is that different from providing feedback about other . |
I'm not saying it's a bad thing necessarily, but it's not like we don't have variety. You used the word consumer, I don't necessarily think of books in terms of goods that way but let's say they are. If you hate chocolate ice cream are you doing to write to the ice cream maker or the 31 flavors store and ask them to stop carrying it? You'll probably just pick another flavor, you're not trying to take away chocolate from everyone. That's how I feel about the secret baby books, I don't write authors and ask them to stop writing them, I pick another flavor.
Linda
_________________
"The Bookshop has a thousand books, all colors, hues and tinges, and every cover is a door that turns on magic hinges." ~ Nancy Byrd Turner |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Sandy AAR
Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 443
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 5:56 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| xina wrote: | | I don't think there is anything wrong with complaining to an author, but I don't know how much good it will do. Doesn't an author write what is inside, and no matter what readers say, they problably aren't going to change. Years ago I was on a message board with Stella Cameron (no, not this board). It was long ago, before I developed a tolerance for the meanish hero. I complained to her telling her how much I hated her hero. She responded by saying...I'm so sorry you were disappointed. That wasn't my intent. And I thought...of course it wasn't. I haven't done that since. Personally, if I don't like an author's direction, I just don't read his/her work. Easy. |
Sad to say I think the days when authors were dictated by their own hearts are long gone these days. Hence the proliferation of All Regency All the Time and Duke books. I know personally a lot of authors writing both who are heartily sick of doing so.
_________________
Sandy AAR
Publisher and Senior Editor |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Eliza
Joined: 21 Aug 2011
Posts: 713
|
| Posted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 6:00 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Linda in sw va wrote: | | I'm not saying it's a bad thing necessarily, but it's not like we don't have variety. You used the word consumer, I don't necessarily think of books in terms of goods that way but let's say they are. If you hate chocolate ice cream are you doing to write to the ice cream maker or the 31 flavors store and ask them to stop carrying it? You'll probably just pick another flavor, you're not trying to take away chocolate from everyone. That's how I feel about the secret baby books, I don't write authors and ask them to stop writing them, I pick another flavor. Linda |
Wow. What a good analogy. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
